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  <title>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference -- 12 May
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  <h1>Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference</h1>

  <h2>12 May 2010</h2>

  <p><a href=
  'http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010May/0020.html'>
  Agenda</a></p>

  <p>See also: <a href=
  "http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-irc">IRC log</a></p>

  <h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>

  <div class="intro">
    <dl>
      <dt>Present</dt>

      <dd>Erik, Davy, Raphael, Silvia</dd>

      <dt>Regrets</dt>

      <dd>Michael</dd>

      <dt>Chair</dt>

      <dd>Erik, Raphael</dd>

      <dt>Scribe</dt>

      <dd>Davy</dd>
    </dl>
  </div>

  <h2>Contents</h2>

  <ul>
    <li>
      <a href="#agenda">Topics</a>

      <ol>
        <li><a href="#item01">1. Admin</a></li>

        <li><a href="#item02">2. Use Cases and
        Requirements</a></li>

        <li><a href="#item03">3. Specification</a></li>

        <li><a href="#item04">4. AOB?</a></li>
      </ol>
    </li>

    <li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
  </ul>
  <hr />

  <div class="meeting">
    <p class='phone'></p>

    <p class='phone'></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Date: 12 May
    2010</p>

    <h3 id="item01">1. Admin</h3>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Scribe: Davy</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt; scribenick: davy</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> no full attendance at
    teleconf :-(</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Previous telecon:
    <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2010/04/14-mediafrag-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/04/14-mediafrag-minutes.html</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Raphael:</cite> if people do not like
    the decisions we take at the teleconfs, they should discuss
    this on the mailing list</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2010/04/28-mediafrag-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/04/28-mediafrag-minutes.html</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2010/05/05-mediafrag-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/05/05-mediafrag-minutes.html</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>silvia</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='phone'>+1</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>erik</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; +1 for accepting
    these minutes</p>

    <p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: minutes
    accepted</strong></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ACTION-92 ?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-92 -- Erik
    Mannens to erik and Raphael to coordinate the writing of papers
    -- due 2010-04-28 -- OPEN</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/92">http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/92</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>raphael:</cite> some parts of the paper
    might be a good starting point for uncomplete sections in the
    spec</p>

    <p class='phone'>close action-92</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-92 Erik and
    Raphael to coordinate the writing of papers closed</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>raphael:</cite> next F2F meeting
    decision -&gt; postpone it to next week</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>erik:</cite> even if we are just with 4
    or 5 people and other people on the phone, we should have a
    meeting</p>

    <p class='phone'><strong class='resolution'>RESOLUTION: next
    F2F meeting will be organized at 15-16 June in
    Eurecom</strong></p><a name="action01" id="action01"></a>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt;
    <strong>ACTION:</strong> troncy to provide practical
    information for the next F2F [recorded in <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01</a>]</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Created ACTION-162
    - Provide practical information for the next F2F [on Raphaël
    Troncy - due 2010-05-19].</p>

    <h3 id="item02">2. Use Cases and Requirements</h3>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ACTION-156?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-156 --
    Conrad Parker to add a "bandwidth conservation use case" -- due
    2010-03-16 -- OPEN</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/156">
    http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/156</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Conrad, could you
    update us on this ?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>silvia</cite>&gt; conrad, are you
    still there?</p>

    <h3 id="item03">3. Specification</h3>

    <p class='phone'>discussing the editorship policy of the
    specification</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Raphael: curently 2
    groups (editors and contributors) while these roles are not
    really defined by W3C, not consistently used depending on the
    spec</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... Suggest that
    Silvia and Davy jump to the editors group, they have edited
    most of the spec</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... Suggest to talk
    with other contributors on the phone regarding their role in
    the spec (for example, Yves contributed a lot of text some
    months ago)</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... I will apply
    the changes on the spec</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ACTION-161?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-161 --
    Silvia Pfeiffer to integrate the test cases into the spec --
    due 2010-04-21 -- OPEN</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/161">
    http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/161</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Silvia:</cite> waiting for a few issues
    that are still issues<br />
    ... 1. #t=a,a and a &gt;= 0 (#2)<br />
    ... is an empty fragment<br />
    ... if we send it to the server, we get a 416<br />
    ... question is whether the client should send it to the server
    or not, since it can detect there will be an error</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>raphael:</cite> empty fragment -&gt; UA
    cannot display anything</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Silvia: we need to
    have a consistent reaction of media fragment aware browsers</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... for legacy
    browsers, they will react as for HTML</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Discussion about
    the empty fragment such as #t=a,a when a&gt;=0</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Silvia: the UA
    still sends a range request and should get back an error
    416</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Davy: but the UA
    knows it is a semantic error, why sending a request at all
    ?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Silvia: the UA
    could simply do nothing ... irritating, but this is happening
    with HTML</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... the fragment is
    not interpreted ?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... we could just
    get the header data of the media file, but stop, not
    downloading any content !</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... for example, a
    Range Request with an empty fragment and only
    "include-setup"</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... the server
    sends the header data of the media resource</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... with a 206
    Partial Content for the header data</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>raphael:</cite> we could apply this
    solution for the three cases</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Similar solution
    for all non-existent or illegal fragments</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... see cases
    detailed at <a href=
    "http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010May/0021.html">
    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010May/0021.html</a></p><a name="action02"
    id="action02"></a>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt;
    <strong>ACTION:</strong> troncy to send a resolution on
    handling non-existing or illegal fragments to the mailinglist
    [recorded in <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02</a>]</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Created ACTION-163
    - Send a resolution on handling non-existing or illegal
    fragments to the mailinglist [on Raphaël Troncy - due
    2010-05-19].</p>

    <p class='phone'>close action-161</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-161
    Integrate the test cases into the spec closed</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ACTIOn-154 ?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-154 -- Yves
    Lafon to add a section 5.2.4 describing his new optimization --
    due 2010-03-16 -- OPEN</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/154">
    http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/154</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Raphael: we have
    described this recipe in the paper and we have the figure</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Raphael: I have a
    plugin for firefox, works with ninsuna with videos already
    ingested</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... will send the
    version to Davy and Silvia for testing now</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... + a readme
    :-)</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Davy: work on
    making Ninsuna acting as a proxy</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Raphael: add a
    parameter in the proxy to specify a proxy ... so get media
    fragments URI on any MP4 videos on the web</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; RESOLUTION:
    re-allocate ACTION-154 to Davy</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ACTION-123?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-123 -- Yves
    Lafon to come up with ABNF for header syntax -- due 2009-12-09
    -- OPEN</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/123">
    http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/123</a></p>

    <p class='phone'>Action-123?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-123 -- Yves
    Lafon to come up with ABNF for header syntax -- due 2009-12-09
    -- OPEN</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/123">
    http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/123</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; RESOLUTION:
    re-allocate ACTION-123 to Silvia</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Silvia: I think we
    should go to LC even if all the features are not resolved</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ... in order to get
    more feedback</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Raphael: agree, f2f
    meeting mid-June and then LC request end of June</p>

    <h3 id="item04">4. AOB?</h3>

    <p class='phone'>[adjourned]</p>
  </div>

  <h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
  Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
  <strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> troncy to provide
  practical information for the next F2F [recorded in <a href=
  "http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action01</a>]<br />

  <strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> troncy to send a
  resolution on handling non-existing or illegal fragments to the
  mailinglist [recorded in <a href=
  "http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-mediafrag-minutes.html#action02</a>]<br />

  &nbsp;<br />
  [End of minutes]<br />
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