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  <h1>- DRAFT -</h1>

  <h1>MAWG</h1>

  <h2>08 Sep 2009</h2>

  <p><a href=
  'http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0015.html'>
  Agenda</a></p>

  <p>See also: <a href=
  "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-irc">IRC log</a></p>

  <h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>

  <div class="intro">
    <dl>
      <dt>Present</dt>

      <dd>joakim, chris, tobias, wonsuk, raphael, fsasaki, tmichel,
      florian, wbailer</dd>

      <dt>Regrets</dt>

      <dt>Chair</dt>

      <dd>Daniel</dd>

      <dt>Scribe</dt>

      <dd>fsasaki</dd>
    </dl>
  </div>

  <h2>Contents</h2>

  <ul>
    <li>
      <a href="#agenda">Topics</a>

      <ol>
        <li><a href="#item01">agenda</a></li>

        <li><a href="#item02">action items</a></li>

        <li><a href="#item03">API related questions</a></li>

        <li><a href="#item04">Digital Data Exchange</a></li>
      </ol>
    </li>

    <li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
  </ul>
  <hr />

  <div class="meeting">
    <p class='phone'>&nbsp;</p>

    <p class='phone'>&nbsp;</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; hi thierry!</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt; scribe: fsasaki</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; trackbot, start
    teleco</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Sorry, raphael, I
    don't understand 'trackbot, start teleco'. Please refer to
    <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc">http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc</a>
    for help</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; trackbot, start
    telecon</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Meeting: Media
    Annotations Working Group Teleconference</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Date: 08 September
    2009</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; hello thierry
    joined</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; I am not sure
    Daniel can make it to the call</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; I can do it</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; Joakim can you
    Chair on behalf of Daniel ?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; Thanks for Chairing
    at last minute, Joakim</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; :-)</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; agenda</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0015.html">
    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0015.html</a></p>

    <h3 id="item01">agenda</h3>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt; chair: joakim</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/01-mediaann-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2009/09/01-mediaann-minutes.html</a></p>

    <p class='phone'>last weeks minutes approved</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; +1 for accepting
    the minutes</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; I can scribe it</p>

    <p class='phone'>scribe for next meeting will be raphael</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/open">
    http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/open</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tmichel</cite>&gt; raphael to scribe
    next week</p>

    <h3 id="item02">action items</h3>

    <p class='phone'>ai 124 pending</p>

    <p class='phone'>ACTION-134, ACTION-135 pending</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.ebu.ch/metadata/cs/web/ebu_RoleCodeCS_p.xml.htm">http://www.ebu.ch/metadata/cs/web/ebu_RoleCodeCS_p.xml.htm</a></p>

    <p class='phone'>ACTION-136 . Joakim looked at tvanytime
    document, seems to be useful. Question: can we use it?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>werner:</cite> we should just reference
    the document<br />
    ... question: are the subtypes normative or just a recommended
    list?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Which type of list
    we are talking about ? the genre ?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>werner:</cite> EBU-list is quite
    comprehensive, people could use just a subset of these</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>wbailer</cite>&gt; roles</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; is TV Anytime
    defining these roles as MPEG-7 CS as in the old time ?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> keep ACTION-136 open for
    now</p>

    <p class='phone'>ACTION-147</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>wbailer</cite>&gt; raphael, ebu has
    these lists also as skos now</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ACTION-147?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-147 --
    Thierry Michel to check status of Web IDL for web api's -- due
    2009-07-03 -- OPEN</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/147">
    http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Annotations/track/actions/147</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>thierry:</cite> sent a message to doug
    from webapp WG</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; wow, great move for
    EBU :-)</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>thierry:</cite> webIDL is just a working
    draft so far, they need us and other working groups who use
    it<br />
    ... doug says currently webIDL is used by HTML5, plan is to use
    it also for DOM3 events<br />
    ... summary: status is still unclear, but it is being
    used<br />
    ... webIDL provides ecmascript and javascript bindings and it
    is easier to user than IDL. My conclusion is that we should
    investigate into that spec</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='phone'>+1</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>wbailer</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>wonsuk</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>thierry:</cite> only drawback is that
    web IDL is not fully stable yet</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; isnt't that a
    chicken-egg problem?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>thierry:</cite> I could check how much
    HTML5 is using web IDL</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> who knows web IDL or IDL
    ?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>wonsuk:</cite> I don't know web IDL, it
    could be a problem for preparing the API draft</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; Victor has come up
    with an IDL version of the API some weeks ago</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tobias</cite>&gt; I don't have
    knowledge about WebIDL either.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; yes he should be
    familiar with it</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; I don't have
    knowledge on it but plan to go through the spec</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; WebIDL: <a href=
    "http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/WebIDL/">http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/WebIDL/</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; i can also look
    into it and help specifying</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>thierry:</cite> two or three people
    should look into web IDL before we decide about using it</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> victor has a good
    knowledge about IDL</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>thierry:</cite> yes, victor should be in
    this task group</p><a name="action01" id="action01"></a>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt;
    <strong>ACTION:</strong> thierry to look into web idl with
    victor and others [recorded in <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action01</a>]</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Created ACTION-152
    - Look into web idl with victor and others [on Thierry Michel -
    due 2009-09-15].</p>

    <p class='phone'>ACTION-148</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>wonsuk:</cite> big issue is that we have
    to decide what kind of API is better<br />
    ... the related issues are on our agenda, want to discuss about
    them later</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> I think style a), very
    simple, is an advantage</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>wonsuk:</cite> would like to know other
    people thinking who were not at the f2f</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; we need to have a
    decision on this soon</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>chris:</cite> not clear to everybody
    what the API is that we have in mind</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; +1 @ chris</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>chris:</cite> the strawman API on the
    wiki is a bit fuzzy<br />
    ... maybe we can come up with a first version of the API
    document and see what the other people think of it</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; I would support
    Chris/Florian proposal for the API document, see <a href=
    "http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0016.html">
    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0016.html</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> so we need it more
    concrete before making a decision</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>chris:</cite> yes</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; also Tobias and
    Vero made comments to the document</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; I thought Victor
    worked on that? Should we ask him on the list what is the
    status of his work?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>florian:</cite> victor plans more work
    on API document. Maybe he could give us some clues about in
    which direction we should go</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>wonsuk:</cite> propose that we prepare
    the API document and also contact victor, in parallel</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> yes, we don't have too
    much time, so good to continue working<br />
    ... need somebody to push the API document forward</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>wonsuk:</cite> I will contact victor, I
    am working with him in the MPEG WG too</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tobias</cite>&gt; Chris also
    volunteered in his email to contribute: <a href=
    "http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0016.html">
    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0016.html</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>chris</cite>&gt; and I shall</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tobias</cite>&gt; :-)</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>florian</cite>&gt; +1 :)</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt;
    get-mawg-unstructured-value</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>joakim</cite>&gt; or
    get-mawg-Creator</p>

    <p class='phone'>wonsuk describing different feedback about his
    proposals for API structure. not sure how to move forward, we
    need a decision which way to go</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>wonsuk:</cite> want to know vote of
    people on the call: what do they want?<br />
    ... prepare the abstract description of the API and make the
    concrete proposal later<br />
    ... is that right?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> problem is that people
    are not quite sure about what we are taking a decision: a
    function for each property or not</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; I suggest to put
    himself in the body of the developer using MAWG API</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; ...
    get-mawg-Creator (or a function for any annotation property) is
    useful, I can't see the use case for a
    get-mawg-unstructured-value function</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>raphael:</cite> API should be just
    useful for a common developer<br />
    ... for each function we should wonder how it would be useful
    for the developer<br />
    ... any function which is related to an annotation property in
    the ontology seems to be useful</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> an API with names of
    functions which are directly related to properties in the
    ontology are easy to understand, abstraction might be more
    difficult for finding out which property is meant</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>raphael:</cite> exactly</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>joakim:</cite> wonsuk, could you
    continue the work with the output of this discussion<br />
    ... wonsuk, could you try to formulate an API definition for
    the draft</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>wonsuk:</cite> yes</p>

    <h3 id="item03">API related questions</h3>

    <p class='phone'><a href=
    "http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Aug/0000.html">
    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Aug/0000.html</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>felix:</cite> happy with the discussion
    today, now waiting for how the draft from wonsuk will look.
    language tag issue will come up later</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; Thanks for the 3
    reviews received from Felix, Werner, and Veronique</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>raphael:</cite> many thanks for the
    comments, the media fragments WG will discuss the comments
    tomorrow<br />
    ... the document has been split into use case part and the core
    specification<br />
    ... the later will be a Recommendation.<br />
    ... thanks for the comments again, we will provide answers
    soon</p>

    <p class='phone'>close ACTION-152</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-152 Look
    into web idl with victor and others closed</p>

    <p class='phone'>close ACTION-150</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; ACTION-150 Review
    the Media Fragments WD closed</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>wbailer</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0006.html">
    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0006.html</a></p>

    <p class='phone'>ACTION-151</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>werner:</cite> wrote some comments, any
    feedback?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; I guess ACTION-152
    should not have been closed right ?</p><a name="action02" id=
    "action02"></a>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt;
    <strong>ACTION:</strong> joakim to look into comments from
    werner on PFWG review [recorded in <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action02</a>]</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Created ACTION-153
    - Look into comments from werner on PFWG review [on Joakim
    Söderberg - due 2009-09-15].</p>

    <h3 id="item04">Digital Data Exchange</h3>

    <p class='phone'><cite>werner:</cite> the work seems to be
    around music<br />
    ... maybe dave could give a comment about whether it makes
    sense to have a liaison</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>raphael</cite>&gt; +1 to ask the
    relationship with Apple stuff, ID3, iTunesXML, etc</p><a name=
    "action03" id="action03"></a>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>scribe</cite>&gt;
    <strong>ACTION:</strong> joakim to ask dave about the
    relationship of digital data exchange with Apple stuff, ID3,
    iTunesXML, etc [recorded in <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action03">http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action03</a>]</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Created ACTION-154
    - Ask dave about the relationship of digital data exchange with
    Apple stuff, ID3, iTunesXML, etc [on Joakim Söderberg - due
    2009-09-15].</p>

    <p class='phone'>meeting adjourned</p>
  </div>

  <h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
  Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
  <strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> joakim to ask
  dave about the relationship of digital data exchange with Apple
  stuff, ID3, iTunesXML, etc [recorded in <a href=
  "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action03">http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action03</a>]<br />

  <strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> joakim to look
  into comments from werner on PFWG review [recorded in <a href=
  "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action02">http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action02</a>]<br />

  <strong>[NEW]</strong> <strong>ACTION:</strong> thierry to look
  into web idl with victor and others [recorded in <a href=
  "http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action01">http://www.w3.org/2009/09/08-mediaann-minutes.html#action01</a>]<br />

  &nbsp;<br />
  [End of minutes]<br />
  <hr />

  <address>
    Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
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    scribe.perl</a> version 1.135 (<a href=
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    $Date: 2009/09/08 12:51:50 $
  </address>

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    <h2>Scribe.perl diagnostic output</h2>[Delete this section
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This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135  of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20  
Check for newer version at <a href=
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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/us it/use it/
Succeeded: s/ACTION-147//
Found Scribe: fsasaki
Inferring ScribeNick: fsasaki
Present: joakim chris tobias wonsuk raphael fsasaki tmichel florian wbailer
Agenda: <a href=
"http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0015.html">http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-annotation/2009Sep/0015.html</a>
Found Date: 08 Sep 2009
Guessing minutes URL: <a href=
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People with action items: joakim thierry

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