03-swxg-minutes.html 15.6 KB
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  <title>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference -- 03 Feb
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  <h1>- DRAFT -</h1>

  <h1>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference</h1>

  <h2>03 Feb 2010</h2>

  <p>See also: <a href="http://www.w3.org/2010/02/03-swxg-irc">IRC
  log</a></p>

  <h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>

  <div class="intro">
    <dl>
      <dt>Present</dt>

      <dd>DKA, +1.510.931.aaaa, anita, [IPcaller], MacTed, Carine,
      melvster, yoshiaki, tpa, +39.011.228.aabb, hhalpin,
      +03120485aacc, rreck, claudio, cperey, pchampin,
      +1.314.683.aadd, alardw, eschnou</dd>

      <dt>Regrets</dt>

      <dt>Chair</dt>

      <dd>DKA</dd>

      <dt>Scribe</dt>

      <dd>yoshiaki</dd>
    </dl>
  </div>

  <h2>Contents</h2>

  <ul>
    <li>
      <a href="#agenda">Topics</a>

      <ol>
        <li><a href="#item01">Action Reminders</a></li>

        <li><a href="#item02">Anita Doehler, Eschnou and Alar on
        OneSocialWebAnita Doehler and Daniel Appelquist on
        OneSocialWeb</a></li>
      </ol>
    </li>

    <li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
  </ul>
  <hr />

  <div class="meeting">
    <p class='phone'></p>

    <p class='phone'></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>trackbot</cite>&gt; Date: 03 February
    2010</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>eschnou</cite>&gt; we are trying to
    call in (eschnou and alardw) but get disconnected..</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; MacTed or
    Yoshi?</p>

    <p class='phone'>I scribe</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; Thanks yoshi!</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; like...</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; hhalpin: saying
    stuff</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>caribou</cite>&gt; Scribe:
    yoshiaki</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; \me when you don't
    want to retype the name, just type ... blah blah</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; ... more stuff</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>DKA</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.w3.org/2010/01/27-swxg-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/01/27-swxg-minutes.html</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; PROPOSED: to
    approve SWXG WG Weekly -- 27 January 2010 as a true record</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tpa</cite>&gt; +1</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>AnitaD</cite>&gt; I can try</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; APPROVED: SWXG WG
    Weekly -- 27 January 2010 as a true record</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tpa</cite>&gt; ok</p>

    <p class='phone'>who is speaking now?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>rreck</cite>&gt; +1 meet again</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> next agenda is
    micropayment.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; APPROVED: meeting
    again Wed. February 10th: Micropayments</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; Doug Schepers and
    Manu Sporny</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; OK...</p>

    <h3 id="item01">Action Reminders</h3>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; we're skipping to
    get straight to talk</p>

    <h3 id="item02">Anita Doehler, Eschnou and Alar on
    OneSocialWebAnita Doehler and Daniel Appelquist on
    OneSocialWeb</h3>

    <p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> I am working at mailing
    list and know many kinds of works of social web.</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnow:</cite> I quickly explain my
    work.<br />
    ... distirbuted social web is work well for everyone.<br />
    ... how we look social web is identify openID, acitivity
    streams,,,,<br />
    ... realize social web requires identity, security, and
    etc.<br />
    ... there's no clear solution and old technologies is not
    enough.<br />
    ... all elements of XMPP is related to social profile and
    exchange social activities.<br />
    ... we make people in touch with each other</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://onesocialweb.org/docs-protocol.html">http://onesocialweb.org/docs-protocol.html</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnow:</cite> we wrote source code by
    the end of the March and open it.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tpa</cite>&gt; The screenlast link at
    the bottom does not work</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tpa</cite>&gt; 404s on Github</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>alardw</cite>&gt; Link to website:
    <a href=
    "http://onesocialweb.org/index-live.html">http://onesocialweb.org/index-live.html</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGLcEN9hFw0">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGLcEN9hFw0</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; screencast</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnow:</cite> screencast is server
    side component<br />
    ... one social web service to web client<br />
    ... screencast is one instance of server for any social network
    to show timeline.<br />
    ... push to all client server<br />
    ... i post my activities with one distributed identfier like
    XMPP and other<br />
    ... we define in activity streams xml name space and we can
    provide data model and name space.</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> do you extend XMPP and
    activity streams/</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> yes. we want to XMPP
    community welcome our extension.<br />
    ... we respect each data models, activity streams; compact
    model and others.</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> we want to ask use
    case<br />
    ... with XMPP and data models you do not need http, smtp.<br />
    ... for web application, diffent kind of interection model,
    very interesting<br />
    ... question about privacy control</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> you can be public and
    privately update status.<br />
    ... you can pinpoint tag people for access control<br />
    ... you can control access of everyone.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; there are some
    interesting standards for tags</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> you repeatedly refer
    tag.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; so the tag is the
    way of doing access control - good idea!</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; I'll get CommonTag
    and TagCommons on a future telecon</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> we develop tagging
    apis</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>Zakim</cite>&gt; tpa, you wanted to
    comment on Privacy filters, Implementation constraints (I can
    wait a while)</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; will get Peter on
    the call...</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; to deal with tag
    ambiguity</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; i.e. if two
    different people use the same tag for access</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> what kind of protocol
    developpers use?<br />
    ... each social application use different protocol</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> there is transport
    protocol, example is activity stereams.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; thanks for
    opensourcing this!</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> write xml perser for
    activity streams and java editor.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; interesting to
    compare this with P2P preso by Kalman Graffi <a href=
    "http://is.gd/7CMm">http://is.gd/7CMm</a> at Dagstuhl last
    week, which is also a P2P java based system</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>hhalpin</cite>&gt; does that count
    gmail? the 100 million number</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> XMPP activities use
    community's effort.<br />
    ... open fire bloging.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; i run an openfire
    server, ill see if i can run this ...</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> XMPP is easy to build
    implementation.<br />
    ... open stack helps us to access other social application's
    data.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>tpa</cite>&gt; yup</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; sorry should have
    been <a href="http://is.gd/7CMm7">http://is.gd/7CMm7</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>carine:</cite> you mension some access
    control language</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; so: P2P preso by
    Kalman Graffi <a href=
    "http://is.gd/7CMm7">http://is.gd/7CMm7</a></p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> there is XML base access
    control but it is too complex.<br />
    ... most of element of protcol is not mature, so we want
    feedback.</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>claudio:</cite> question about android
    version</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> we are wainting the
    platform get to be stable.<br />
    ... we are intend to create with html and javascript by end of
    march.<br />
    ... Android's architecture is different from iPhone.<br />
    ... XMPP runs stable on android and use less battery power.</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> what's your feeling
    about of future of standard XMPP based?<br />
    ... do you found XMPP foundation, or collaborate with W3C?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> most of use case needs
    more extention.<br />
    ... google wave shows us XMPP is application.<br />
    ... google wave has very simple protocol.<br />
    ... XMPP and activity stream change social application.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; access control on
    wave is very difficult</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> but we don't want to
    users type their status.<br />
    ... google has not propose security of wave's client<br />
    ... server have to no data in servers.<br />
    ... google wave is not centralize.<br />
    ... all the data together in one server or another. all your
    activities, all your media asset is aggregated in the
    server.<br />
    ... you can download source code for server, and use outside of
    the internet.<br />
    ... you can keep several server and each server can be used for
    different usage.</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>bblfish:</cite> Question about P2P
    server?<br />
    ... when document exchange, is document duplicated?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>DKA</cite>&gt; :)</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>bblfish:</cite> when requesting
    document, we have layer for document exchange?<br />
    ... http or smtp is basic system? and how is semantics?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>eschnou:</cite> semantics is needed in
    application layer.</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>bblfish:</cite> XMPP is http P2P
    system?</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>eschnou:</cite> there is fantastic
    conversation in public mailing list.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; question: should
    we cross post to the onesocialweb mailing list?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>cperey</cite>&gt; where is the One
    Social Web mailing list?</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; <a href=
    "http://groups.google.com/group/onesocialweb?lnk=srg">http://groups.google.com/group/onesocialweb?lnk=srg</a></p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; one social web
    mailing list</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>melvster:</cite> question about high
    level principle of social web</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; So the first part
    was to compare three systems HTTP, XMPP, P2P based mentioned
    above.</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; All three have the
    following elements:</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; - a document
    exchange protocol</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; - a syntax (or more
    in the case of HTTP) for exchanging docs</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; - semantics
    associated with the docs</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>alardw</cite>&gt; thanks everyone
    would there be any further questions please ping us</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; ( - and behavior
    associated with message requests )</p>

    <p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> we have to re-schedule
    agenda about micropayment.<br />
    ... and other agenda</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; from this an
    intersting point comes up: that at least the semantics between
    XMPP, HTTP, and other systems can be agreed upon</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>rreck</cite>&gt; thanks for
    presenting</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>bblfish</cite>&gt; ie, any social
    networking service should be able to interoperate at the
    semantic layer</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>melvster</cite>&gt; thanks</p>

    <p class='phone'>thank you!</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>DKA</cite>&gt; Thanks all!</p>

    <p class='irc'>&lt;<cite>eschnou</cite>&gt; thanks everyone for
    the questions and feedback !</p>
  </div>

  <h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
  Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
  [End of minutes]<br />
  <hr />

  <address>
    Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
    "http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
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    $Date: 2010/02/03 17:44:54 $
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    <h2>Scribe.perl diagnostic output</h2>[Delete this section
    before finalizing the minutes.]<br />
    <pre>
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135  of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20  
Check for newer version at <a href=
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/">http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/</a>

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/hhaplpin/hhalpin/
Succeeded: s/tpa:/hhalpin:/
Succeeded: s/claudio:/carine:/
Succeeded: s/sensurize/centralize/
Succeeded: s/DKA: question about PHP server?/bblfish: Question about P2P server?/
Found Scribe: yoshiaki
Inferring ScribeNick: yoshiaki
Default Present: DKA, +1.510.931.aaaa, anita, [IPcaller], MacTed, Carine, melvster, yoshiaki, tpa, +39.011.228.aabb, hhalpin, +03120485aacc, rreck, claudio, cperey, pchampin, +1.314.683.aadd, alardw, eschnou
Present: DKA +1.510.931.aaaa anita [IPcaller] MacTed Carine melvster yoshiaki tpa +39.011.228.aabb hhalpin +03120485aacc rreck claudio cperey pchampin +1.314.683.aadd alardw eschnou
Found Date: 03 Feb 2010
Guessing minutes URL: <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/03-swxg-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/02/03-swxg-minutes.html</a>
People with action items: 

</pre>[End of <a href=
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