03-swxg-minutes.html
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<title>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference -- 03 Feb
2010</title>
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<h1>- DRAFT -</h1>
<h1>Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference</h1>
<h2>03 Feb 2010</h2>
<p>See also: <a href="http://www.w3.org/2010/02/03-swxg-irc">IRC
log</a></p>
<h2><a name="attendees" id="attendees">Attendees</a></h2>
<div class="intro">
<dl>
<dt>Present</dt>
<dd>DKA, +1.510.931.aaaa, anita, [IPcaller], MacTed, Carine,
melvster, yoshiaki, tpa, +39.011.228.aabb, hhalpin,
+03120485aacc, rreck, claudio, cperey, pchampin,
+1.314.683.aadd, alardw, eschnou</dd>
<dt>Regrets</dt>
<dt>Chair</dt>
<dd>DKA</dd>
<dt>Scribe</dt>
<dd>yoshiaki</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<h2>Contents</h2>
<ul>
<li>
<a href="#agenda">Topics</a>
<ol>
<li><a href="#item01">Action Reminders</a></li>
<li><a href="#item02">Anita Doehler, Eschnou and Alar on
OneSocialWebAnita Doehler and Daniel Appelquist on
OneSocialWeb</a></li>
</ol>
</li>
<li><a href="#ActionSummary">Summary of Action Items</a></li>
</ul>
<hr />
<div class="meeting">
<p class='phone'></p>
<p class='phone'></p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>trackbot</cite>> Date: 03 February
2010</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>eschnou</cite>> we are trying to
call in (eschnou and alardw) but get disconnected..</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> MacTed or
Yoshi?</p>
<p class='phone'>I scribe</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Thanks yoshi!</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> like...</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> hhalpin: saying
stuff</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>caribou</cite>> Scribe:
yoshiaki</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> \me when you don't
want to retype the name, just type ... blah blah</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> ... more stuff</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/01/27-swxg-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/01/27-swxg-minutes.html</a></p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> PROPOSED: to
approve SWXG WG Weekly -- 27 January 2010 as a true record</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> +1</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> +1</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>AnitaD</cite>> I can try</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> APPROVED: SWXG WG
Weekly -- 27 January 2010 as a true record</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> ok</p>
<p class='phone'>who is speaking now?</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> +1 meet again</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> next agenda is
micropayment.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> APPROVED: meeting
again Wed. February 10th: Micropayments</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> Doug Schepers and
Manu Sporny</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> OK...</p>
<h3 id="item01">Action Reminders</h3>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> we're skipping to
get straight to talk</p>
<h3 id="item02">Anita Doehler, Eschnou and Alar on
OneSocialWebAnita Doehler and Daniel Appelquist on
OneSocialWeb</h3>
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> I am working at mailing
list and know many kinds of works of social web.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnow:</cite> I quickly explain my
work.<br />
... distirbuted social web is work well for everyone.<br />
... how we look social web is identify openID, acitivity
streams,,,,<br />
... realize social web requires identity, security, and
etc.<br />
... there's no clear solution and old technologies is not
enough.<br />
... all elements of XMPP is related to social profile and
exchange social activities.<br />
... we make people in touch with each other</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> <a href=
"http://onesocialweb.org/docs-protocol.html">http://onesocialweb.org/docs-protocol.html</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnow:</cite> we wrote source code by
the end of the March and open it.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> The screenlast link at
the bottom does not work</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> 404s on Github</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>alardw</cite>> Link to website:
<a href=
"http://onesocialweb.org/index-live.html">http://onesocialweb.org/index-live.html</a></p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> <a href=
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGLcEN9hFw0">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGLcEN9hFw0</a></p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> screencast</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnow:</cite> screencast is server
side component<br />
... one social web service to web client<br />
... screencast is one instance of server for any social network
to show timeline.<br />
... push to all client server<br />
... i post my activities with one distributed identfier like
XMPP and other<br />
... we define in activity streams xml name space and we can
provide data model and name space.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>cperey:</cite> do you extend XMPP and
activity streams/</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> yes. we want to XMPP
community welcome our extension.<br />
... we respect each data models, activity streams; compact
model and others.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> we want to ask use
case<br />
... with XMPP and data models you do not need http, smtp.<br />
... for web application, diffent kind of interection model,
very interesting<br />
... question about privacy control</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> you can be public and
privately update status.<br />
... you can pinpoint tag people for access control<br />
... you can control access of everyone.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> there are some
interesting standards for tags</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> you repeatedly refer
tag.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> so the tag is the
way of doing access control - good idea!</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> I'll get CommonTag
and TagCommons on a future telecon</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> we develop tagging
apis</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>Zakim</cite>> tpa, you wanted to
comment on Privacy filters, Implementation constraints (I can
wait a while)</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> will get Peter on
the call...</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> to deal with tag
ambiguity</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> i.e. if two
different people use the same tag for access</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>tpa:</cite> what kind of protocol
developpers use?<br />
... each social application use different protocol</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> there is transport
protocol, example is activity stereams.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> thanks for
opensourcing this!</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> write xml perser for
activity streams and java editor.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> interesting to
compare this with P2P preso by Kalman Graffi <a href=
"http://is.gd/7CMm">http://is.gd/7CMm</a> at Dagstuhl last
week, which is also a P2P java based system</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>hhalpin</cite>> does that count
gmail? the 100 million number</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> XMPP activities use
community's effort.<br />
... open fire bloging.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> i run an openfire
server, ill see if i can run this ...</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> XMPP is easy to build
implementation.<br />
... open stack helps us to access other social application's
data.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>tpa</cite>> yup</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> sorry should have
been <a href="http://is.gd/7CMm7">http://is.gd/7CMm7</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>carine:</cite> you mension some access
control language</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> so: P2P preso by
Kalman Graffi <a href=
"http://is.gd/7CMm7">http://is.gd/7CMm7</a></p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> there is XML base access
control but it is too complex.<br />
... most of element of protcol is not mature, so we want
feedback.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>claudio:</cite> question about android
version</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> we are wainting the
platform get to be stable.<br />
... we are intend to create with html and javascript by end of
march.<br />
... Android's architecture is different from iPhone.<br />
... XMPP runs stable on android and use less battery power.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> what's your feeling
about of future of standard XMPP based?<br />
... do you found XMPP foundation, or collaborate with W3C?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> most of use case needs
more extention.<br />
... google wave shows us XMPP is application.<br />
... google wave has very simple protocol.<br />
... XMPP and activity stream change social application.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> access control on
wave is very difficult</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>Eschnou:</cite> but we don't want to
users type their status.<br />
... google has not propose security of wave's client<br />
... server have to no data in servers.<br />
... google wave is not centralize.<br />
... all the data together in one server or another. all your
activities, all your media asset is aggregated in the
server.<br />
... you can download source code for server, and use outside of
the internet.<br />
... you can keep several server and each server can be used for
different usage.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>bblfish:</cite> Question about P2P
server?<br />
... when document exchange, is document duplicated?</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> :)</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>bblfish:</cite> when requesting
document, we have layer for document exchange?<br />
... http or smtp is basic system? and how is semantics?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>eschnou:</cite> semantics is needed in
application layer.</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>bblfish:</cite> XMPP is http P2P
system?</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>eschnou:</cite> there is fantastic
conversation in public mailing list.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> question: should
we cross post to the onesocialweb mailing list?</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>cperey</cite>> where is the One
Social Web mailing list?</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> <a href=
"http://groups.google.com/group/onesocialweb?lnk=srg">http://groups.google.com/group/onesocialweb?lnk=srg</a></p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> one social web
mailing list</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>melvster:</cite> question about high
level principle of social web</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> So the first part
was to compare three systems HTTP, XMPP, P2P based mentioned
above.</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> All three have the
following elements:</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> - a document
exchange protocol</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> - a syntax (or more
in the case of HTTP) for exchanging docs</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> - semantics
associated with the docs</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>alardw</cite>> thanks everyone
would there be any further questions please ping us</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> ( - and behavior
associated with message requests )</p>
<p class='phone'><cite>hhalpin:</cite> we have to re-schedule
agenda about micropayment.<br />
... and other agenda</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> from this an
intersting point comes up: that at least the semantics between
XMPP, HTTP, and other systems can be agreed upon</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>rreck</cite>> thanks for
presenting</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>bblfish</cite>> ie, any social
networking service should be able to interoperate at the
semantic layer</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>melvster</cite>> thanks</p>
<p class='phone'>thank you!</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>DKA</cite>> Thanks all!</p>
<p class='irc'><<cite>eschnou</cite>> thanks everyone for
the questions and feedback !</p>
</div>
<h2><a name="ActionSummary" id="ActionSummary">Summary of Action
Items</a></h2><!-- Action Items -->
[End of minutes]<br />
<hr />
<address>
Minutes formatted by David Booth's <a href=
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm">
scribe.perl</a> version 1.135 (<a href=
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$Date: 2010/02/03 17:44:54 $
</address>
<div class="diagnostics">
<hr />
<h2>Scribe.perl diagnostic output</h2>[Delete this section
before finalizing the minutes.]<br />
<pre>
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20
Check for newer version at <a href=
"http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/">http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/</a>
Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
Succeeded: s/hhaplpin/hhalpin/
Succeeded: s/tpa:/hhalpin:/
Succeeded: s/claudio:/carine:/
Succeeded: s/sensurize/centralize/
Succeeded: s/DKA: question about PHP server?/bblfish: Question about P2P server?/
Found Scribe: yoshiaki
Inferring ScribeNick: yoshiaki
Default Present: DKA, +1.510.931.aaaa, anita, [IPcaller], MacTed, Carine, melvster, yoshiaki, tpa, +39.011.228.aabb, hhalpin, +03120485aacc, rreck, claudio, cperey, pchampin, +1.314.683.aadd, alardw, eschnou
Present: DKA +1.510.931.aaaa anita [IPcaller] MacTed Carine melvster yoshiaki tpa +39.011.228.aabb hhalpin +03120485aacc rreck claudio cperey pchampin +1.314.683.aadd alardw eschnou
Found Date: 03 Feb 2010
Guessing minutes URL: <a href=
"http://www.w3.org/2010/02/03-swxg-minutes.html">http://www.w3.org/2010/02/03-swxg-minutes.html</a>
People with action items:
</pre>[End of <a href=
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scribe.perl</a> diagnostic output]
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